Thursday Thoughts: Kobe & LeBron Lines
Let’s delve into something that is apparent in the sneaker culture today. Every day we get sneaker news about release dates, future releases, samples, sneaker collections, celebs rocking sneakers, etc. Whether we think the news is good or bad is always up for debate. So let’s talk about…
The Kobe/LeBron Line As Of Now
It’s safe to say that the Kobe and LeBron lines are the most prone Nike Basketball sneakers to see retros in the future due to their popularity, moreso the LeBron line. This one will be short but the general question of it is, how do you feel?
The LeBron and Kobe lines have dropped their fair share of eye popping quickstrikes and highly sought after colorways but there has always been something lacking from each when comparing to the Jordan Brand.
Jeff Wairi (idea topic credit goes to him) brings up a good point:
“I think what made Jordans so incredible were the fact that he played in them, making history wearing them.”
Sure, there are plenty of Jordan’s he had no playing time in and really had no relevance to his game as a whole but there are shoes that tell a story based on the name and not just about the shoe itself. Example, 20 years down the road, if someone asks about the LeBron 8 “Pre-Heats” or the Kobe 6 “3D,” most likely people are just going to say they released and a lot of people wanted them. There really isn’t anything else behind them other than that. There may be a minor story about the colorway but it doesn’t have the impact that the Jordan Brand had. There are a few colorways that reflect something like Kobe winning a certain amount of rings or an MVP colorway for LeBron but those were specifically made for those nicknames, they didn’t garner the nicknames on their own.
Now look at a few Jordan shoes, the Last Shot XIV’s, Flu Game XII’s, even the Space Jam XI’s for crying out loud. It goes further than that though, ask any Jordan head about the history of some OG colorway and they’ll probably have some story behind it regardless of the nickname the shoe is given. For Jordans, it seems like it’s more about the story in itself outside of the shoe which makes them so dope. People remember those moments when Jordan did something amazing and some people remember the shoes he was in doing so. It’s like each shoe was part of the story Jordan was telling on the court. I could go on and write a novel on this subject but since this paragraph has been brief and short, I’ll keep it that way.
Point is, there hasn’t been any narrative backgrounds with the LeBron/Kobe line as of yet. You may be able to find a game that stood out in their careers and remember what shoe they were wearing but it just, doesn’t hold a candle to the Jordan tales. Maybe it’s because it’s Jordan and he started the whole shoe ordeal or maybe it’s because LeBron/Kobe or any NBA player for that matter hasn’t had multiple and endless glorifying moments on the court (along with multiple sneakers). It’s really up to the reader/watcher to decide.
This topic is so broad it could go on for pages but it’s WAY too hard to cover every aspect of it. All in all, there are multiple questions that can be answered and plenty of discussions to be discussed.
What do you think the Kobe/LeBron lines are missing when compared to Jordan’s? Do you think any basketball line will ever match the iconic status that Jordan’s have? How do you feel as of now about the status and growth of the Kobe/LeBron lines and the future?
It’s not really about “do you like x’s line better than x?” It’s more about what they have done for sneakers and what they represent. It’s really an open topic for debate, so feel free to speak up about anything apparent to this post.
Written By: Jawrduhn
Idea by: Jeff Wairi
Photo: Eastbay
See something in the sneaker culture that catches your eye and drives you crazy or impresses you? Send it to Jordan.Rainey [@] theshoegame.com (topic only), and it could be used in a future Thursday Thoughts. Credit will be given if the idea has not already been planned or submitted by someone else. Remember, it can be anything sneaker related. Put “Thursday Thoughts” as the subject of the email.
well written article, and I think you helped to name that missing factor from both Kobe and Bron’s line that sometimes people don’t quite understand when all of us old timers go on and on about how important Js are.
“Maybe it’s because it’s Jordan and he started the whole shoe ordeal” author ^^
I think you touched on the key point. When the Jordan line started it wasn’t the first of its kind as far as a signature lines are concerned, but it was by far the most polarizing. It came at a time when a young star was developing and fans were beginning to get to know him. Add to that the influence of Hip-Hop and the boom of the drug trade, sales begin to take off. Other players had sig models (think Magic, Bird, Worthy, etc) but they were older established player and MJ was fresh and new with FLASH, appealing to a younger generation. As we grew with MJ, we became attached. Consistent releases, fresh designs, coupled with someone who would become a proven winner. Fast forward to the current times, there are more brands in the marketplace, and sig models are ABUNDANT. There was once a time when there were a handful of “superstars”, and now the fan has numerous that they could call a star. In MJs era, he was THE star of the league, undoubtedly top 5 on everyone’s list (unless you lived in NY, LA or Boston lol). It’s argued daily who’s best today…LBJ? Kobe? DWade? Durant? The population is divided, and I don’t think sales for the current sig lines will ever match the trajectory that the Jordan line did. As for the brand, Jordan fans are getting older, and MJ hasn’t played in years. They did a good job of capturing young talent to keep the line relevant but the man we grew up with is not necessarily the face of the brand anymore. Retro releases will ALWAYS sell, but what happens when all of the models have been re-released? There is a percentage of the population who has never seen him play, but associate the line with greatness, be it in fashion or on court. Many have instilled the love of the line into their siblings and offspring. The remaining population as I said before is split. There is loyalty to Kobe, Lebron, KD, DRose, D12 etc. and the lines are drawn there which will prevent one brand from cornering the market the way the Jordan line once did.
Good read and very true. Kobe line more comfortable and Lebron Line better looking.
I THINK THE BIGGEST DIFFERENCE WITH JORDAN WAS THAT HE TOOK US ON A JOURNEY. WHAT DO I MEAN BY THAT?? AS JORDAN’S GAME GREW AND HE ACCOMPLISHED ALL THE AMAZING STATS AND BLAH BLAH.. HIS LEGEND GREW.. AS DID HIS SHOE LINE.. ADVERTISING PLAYED A ROLE BUT HIS PLAY WAS HIS ADVERTISING… HE DEFEATED ALL THE GREATS… IN THE LAST 30 YEARS. MAGIC, BIRD, WILKINS, EWING, DREXLER, DUMARS, THOMAS, BARKLEY, MALONE, MILLER, STOCKTON AND THE LIST GOES ON. KOBE NOR LEBRON DON’T HAVE THAT!!! PLUS THEY HAVE BEEN DEFEATED IN FINALS TWICE EACH WHICH IN A LOT OF WAYS DIMINISHES THE MYSTIQUE.
THE FACT THAT JORDAN WENT TO THE FINALS 6 TIMES AND NEVER LOST IS INSANE. I DON’T KNOW WHAT OTHER GREAT HAS BEEN TO THE FINALS THAT MANY TIMES AND NOT LOST AT LEAST ONE. HELL, KOBE AND LEBRON HAVEN’T EVEN PLAYED EACHOTHER IN A FINAL EITHER.. I THINK THAT IS SOMETHING ELSE THAT DIMINISHES THE MYSTIQUE.. MAYBE IF THEY PLAY EACH OTHER A NUMBER OF TIMES THE LEGEND WILL GROW.
I TIE THAT IN TO THE REASON THAT JORDAN EARNED HIS STRIPES ON THE COURT.. THERE WASN’T ALL THE MEDIA HYPE FROM HIGHSCHOOL STRAIGHT TO THE PROS.. NO BIG SNEAKER DEAL BEFORE HE DID ANYTHING ON THE COURT…BLAH BLAH.. YOU GET THE POINT. EVEN THOUGH KOBE HAS WON 5 FOR SOME REASON PEOPLE SEE SHAQ AS THE LEADER IN 3 BUT MJ WAS CLEARLY THE BATMAN IN HIS 6 WHILE SCOTTIE AS IMPORTANT AS HE WAS ROBIN OR BATMAN II … LOL..
YOU PUT ALL OF THAT .. MIX IT IN A POT AND VOILA!!! YOU HAVE A RECIPE FOR GRAND SUCCESS WHICH IS WHY THE JORDAN “BRAND” WILL NEVER FADE. THE BRAND HAS TRANSCENDED ALMOST 30 YRS, 2-3 GENERATIONS AND HAS NO SIGNS OF SLOWING DOWN.
AND THAT IS JUST ON THE COURT.. OFF THE COURT IN URBAN AREAS . THE KOBE AND LEBRON DON’T EVEN OUT DUEL THE AF1 SO FORGET IT. THAT’S A WHOLE OTHER SECTION TO BE DISCUSSED LIKE YOU SAID JAWRDUHN
nice article. although I grew up as Jordans evolved, Im really getting tired of wearing the same style shoes as i did as a kid. I know they are classics and all but I have like 90% of all the Jordans I ever wanted in my closet currently. Now I appreciate all the new signature lines a little more because of new technology, style and different looks. I will always love Jordan but I “lust” for more up to date signature baskeball shoes. lol
Something that no one mentioned is that J’s were so different from year to year that you can distinctly remember what he did in each respective model #. His most famous dunk in the 3′s. “The Shot” in the 4′s. First championship in the 6′s. The list goes on and on. Its not like Kobe and Lebron haven’t done memorable things its just that the silhouettes of their shoes have been so similar from year to year that most won’t remember if Kobe dropped 81 in the Zoom Kobe 1 or Zoom Kobe 2 (it was the Kobe 1 I believe).
Allow me to point out a Nike marketing FAIL = Lebron 8 PS FINALS
Here Nike makes an elite CW for the FINALS… Bron wears them once… Heat lose the FINALS. Yet, this becomes some exclusive release!?!?
Contrast = Jordan XII, XIII, and XIV Playoffs/FInals (insert AM95′s point here) and mind you these were GENERAL RELEASES
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RETRO-ABILITY – Too many little exclusive and limited releases so I 100% agree with Jawrduhn’s take on this!
Kobe – I think we’d like a Kobe “associated” retro model like the 1st generation Huarache right now… can’t see anything else being a “now” retro from him with Nike (Crazy 8′s were a good drop from Adidas)!?!?
Lebron – Lebron II’s PLEASE! I could see the AZG’s being an interesting release with some new CW’s and a Dunkman release!
Looks: Lebron
Comfort: Kobe (Nike and Adidas)
Jordans are in a different category all together. Being older I grew up watching Jordan debut his new shoes every year and a fresh colorway just for the playoffs. Nobody did that before. He was not the first to have a signature shoe but he did it in a way that literally broke “color lines” from the start. And the design technology grew with his talent and championship rings… LEGEND!
…just my opinion
Wow! I just realized my Cool Grey LeBrons(VII) are Og’s! Ha! These things are gonna be worth millions……..right? Its quite simple Jordan was the man,will always be the man. I don’t own any Kobes and I have a couple pair of LeBrons. It maybe a generation thing but I will always pick Mikes kicks over those other two guys.
I need those Grinches… It still hunt me that i was the 4th in line at footlocker and left because i thought that niketown had them too… I got there and it was pack, lol got back to Footlocker and my size was gone… ARRGGGGG LOLL
Anyway, in my collection Jordan line will always be my favorites, but i love my kobes/lebrons almost the sameway. Give it time and the Kobe/Lebron line will have their place in history. Maybe they will never surpass JB brand because of their legacy, but they will blow away anyother line and brands. Everything takes time.
This may be one of the most thought provoking articles written to date. Kudos Jawrduhn.
Who remembers “Come Fly With Me”??? That’s the type stuff the players these days are missing..
Jordan was a better player, everyone wanted to be “like mike” to coin the phrase. I don’t think either of these athletes are up to par or near his iconicness. I was actually wondering when they’d stop the retro lines (numbered) seeing how Michael’s stopped at 23 but Lebron’s seems to surpass his number.
I don’t think we can judge the Kobe and LeBron Lines right now. Most of us “grew up” with Jordan and his sneakers. The people that will feel about Lebron/Kobe, how we feel about Jordan, are the kids growing up with them. I talked with a 9 year old today that was wearing the Lebron VIII V2. I asked him about his shoes and his eyes lit up. In 15-20 years, when he sees those shoes again, he’ll feel just like we feel when we see a pair of cement IVs.
-BTS
The Lebron line definitely wins in the style/looks department EASY. I’ve never been a fan of Kobe’s low tops nor have I owned a pair but they just seem to look all too similar to me. Plus the Kobe Zoom 3′s are just nasty.
TOO MANY DAMN COLORWAYS.
That’s all I gotta say.
TOO MANY DAMN COLORWAYS.
and then, there’s TOO MANY COLORWAYS THEY NEVER WORE.
or if they did wear them,
They had no historical significance.
There are some…but very few.
Therefore, there’s RARELY anything SPECIAL.
In the long run, it’s ALL ABOUT TIME.
We have to wait 20 YEARS before we’ll know if these shoes mean anything.
But, hell, if you’re collecting for a pay off in 20 years…
you’re doing it all wrong anyway.
I got one more thing to say about historical significance in comparison to JORDAN.
Take the 2 shoes above.
The Grinch and the Christmas Lebron.
They were worn by Kobe & Lebron on a X-Mas day game where we were expecting to see a BATTLE OF THE ICONS.
What did we get?
A WACK A$$ GAME WHERE THE LAKERS GOT THEY A$$ WHOOPED…AT STAPLES!!!
From a sneakerhead perspective…”OH…THESE ARE LIMITED…I GOTTA HAVE EM!”
From a historical/basketball perspective… “that was a wack game…i thought these two were supposed to be GREAT.”
And that’s the difference.
Take the DMP Packs. DEFINING MOMENTS PACK.
What are going to be the DEFINING MOMENTS for These two?
There are some…
and there “might” be more.
but again, only TIME will tell.
first jordan has a lot of championship memorable moments in his kicks both playoffs and finals…lebron, and not hating, has no rings and his memorable moments have come in mostly the solider line not his sig…2nd and most importantly the bron and kobe lines have a lot more colorways..the jordan line had four during a whole year..seems both bron and kobe lines have 4 cw every 2 weeks. bron has no rings so he is out right away. as per kobe the 81 pt kobe1 never dropped to the public. that last shot in 2006 kobe1 aka laker cw home cw never dropped. the mvp iv is pretty memorable as it was kobe;s first chip without shaq..the home big stage was his 2nd chip but most of kobe’s limited shoes such as mlk iv and what have you were not too memorable games. i would say the kobeiv all star and kobevi all star are memorable for the fact he was mvp in those all star games..get my point..just too many colorways to make us heads say..oh..that shoe!!!
I think that the Kobe/Lebron, maybe even KD, lines will see retros in the future. They probably won’t be as big as the Jordan line though for the reasons mentioned in the article. I kinda see the retros being like the Penny/CB/Pippen lines. Not too much history or anything like that, but great lines and retros anyway.
As a younger sneaker collector, i agree with most of these points, although i can never say i know what it was like to grow up watching micheal play and the event that was jordan releases on weekends, i have enough knowledge to respect the history of jordans.
I also can see how LeBrons may be important in 20 years, but like the above comments, lebron does not have any jaw dropping moments in particular shoes, a stretch would be to include the high scoring games at MSG but even then i dont remeber what shoes he was wearing.
Time will tell with the LeBron line, but for now Jordan’s can’t be matched in sentimental value to people.
if Kobe can get one more ring then his shoe line in time will just as memorable as jordans.
its all about rings man, Jordan is #1 and Kobe #2.
Lebron is lebron, nothin much to say about his shoes. But every body in the league wears Kobe’s so there u have it.
Thanks for the love Jawrduhn, really means a lot to me. Been a reader of this site for about a year now and it means a lot to be featured on it.
I love all the comments and they’re all really interesting. To me, i could never see myself buying a pair of basketball shoes that are a signature line of someone currently playing because there’s no history in that. I think 75% of the sneaker is the history behind it. Jordan broke records, won championships, broke barriors, and most importantly, broke necks in his sneakers. The fact that you could wear a sneaker that the EXACT same model as the one MJ crossed up larry bird in, is a feeling like no other. I’m only 17 but trust me, i know a lot more than the average. I can’t see myself buying anything other than an OG colorway because theres no history in a pair of sneakers like the “wolf grey’s.” Everything i buy, i research. I feel like i have to prove my sneaker knowledge all the time because of my age. I love the sneaker game, but most importantly, the history of the game.
Much appreciated Jawrduhn and thanks TSG community for the comments!
When Kobe has had “Memorable Moments” we don’t think about what shoes he was wearing.
He has had a lot like the 81 point game, game winner against the suns (06 playoffs),
Kobe (62 points) outscoring the Dallas Mavericks in 3 quarters etc etc.
Kobe is a sick bastard, LeBron on the other hand….. hmmm.
T-MAC 13 points in 35sec (Rocking Hug 4s) BOSSSSSSSSSSS
Ok nice article but I have to make some points clear… It seems LBJ and KObe shoe lines will never amount to to what MJ shoes has.. for instances how many times were the Jordan 9s black and white released? Can u see any LBJ or Kobe shoe released that many times?? Also MJ winning championships has nothing to do with his sneaker legacy.. Penny and Barkley won zero rings and yet the shoe lines are still a a vital part of the sneaker culture. One thing I see is a whole lot special edition lebrons and kobe’s not released in the US which I feel hurt them cause those color ways actually be the best. So my last point lebron and Kobe sneakers will never amount to MJ just like they will never reach the bar Michael set on court!
good article…I dont see anyone really living up to that Jordan line..regardless of who it is…he basically paved the way for players to actually have a line to begin with….cause of the fact that his shoes were so iconic…..it cant happen again..and it wont…
Prestige is what lacks. That’s why most people favor the earlier jordan models 1-12, then the latter 13+. Sneakers that aren’t 1-12 jordans aren’t as prestigous because of lack of play and their not as old as the other models.
This is a very well written article but i felt you can argue some of the points made in the article. It’s true no one will ever be great as jordan or the jordan brand. But 20 years from now, when nike decides to start retroing the kobe/lebron lines there will be something that attaches people to the sneaker.For example kobe’s 81 point game,kobe’s 62 point in msg,lebron 48 pnts game 5,lebron triple double in msg…the south beach’s are going to be viewed as the sneakers that are linked to the decision of taking his talents to south beach.They won’t be as great as the jordan brand but they won’t be no slouch either
The shoe nicknames listed in the article were not really good examples because neither player could have “last shots” and both players have not had a severe case of the flu that coincided with a game. But the Christmas game is one that we will remember and both sneakers will be remembered. Sorry will have to disagree with REE that was a great game.
i cant wait till kobe makes a shoe for his 81 pts, Definitely a defining moment